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[05:35] < Lawouach_> hello all

[06:05] < MS-> morning

[06:28] < Lawouach_> you're gonna make me feel bad with your diet mate :)

[06:38] < MS-> :)

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[06:39] < MS-> I realised a couple of months back that my BMI approaching 35 (it'd just tipped over 34) was a v bad thing, and decided to do something about it.

[06:43] < Lawouach_> yeah mine must be 28/29

[06:44] < MS-> :)

[06:44] < MS-> I'd be very pleased to get down to that level :)

[06:47] < Lawouach_> Health wise it's still too high

[06:47] < MS-> I'm about 4 months from that I think, based on my stats (tracking loss in a spreadsheet)

[06:47] < MS-> Well, yes, but it's still better :)

[06:47] < Lawouach_> and feeling wise, well, one is never happy with what one has

[06:47] *** MS- nods

[06:48] < Lawouach_> mind you, most of my friends reaching the age of 30 seem to gain in weight anyway

[06:48] < Lawouach_> so my feelings aren't so bad :)

[06:48] < MS-> heh. I think it's a common thing

[06:49] < MS-> Up to 25-30, most people's metabolism self regulates well

[06:49] < MS-> post 30 it self-regulates worse

[06:49] < Lawouach_> yeah, it's because one of the protein our body produces to regulate our metabolism stops at 30

[06:50] < Lawouach_> so everybody takes on weight then

[06:50] < Lawouach_> indeed

[06:51] < MS-> The primary change I've made to my diet fwiw, is twofold

[06:51] < MS-> firstly I snack (ie small portions) on protein rich foods when I'm hungry

[06:51] < MS-> That's due to some research that says that protein acts as an appetite suppressant

[06:51] < MS-> Means that snacking does stop me feeling hungry - means if I'm hungry I can eat :)

[06:52] < MS-> second change is to just eat stuff that would be relatively easily accessible to someone most of the year round, and potentially eatable raw.

[06:52] < MS-> That does limit my fruit intake (since that would be rare year round normally)

[06:53] < MS-> It also limits eating of root vegetables and grain etc since they're rarely edible raw

[06:54] < MS-> But any meat, fish, salad, nut, peanut, type thing is fair game, but focussed on a chunk of protein first, then lighter stuff

[06:54] < MS-> Also, I'm not being dogmatic about it

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[06:54] < MS-> Having one diet coke a week doesn't mean you lose weight, and conversely one ice cream or similar a week doesn't really break a diet

[06:55] *** MS- stops being boring about diet :)

[06:55] < Lawouach_> :)

[06:55] < MS-> Should write a book on it and put it on lulu.com when I'm done

[06:55] < Lawouach_> dieting is hard, let's go shopping

[06:55] < MS-> Make a fortune or something

[06:55] < MS-> hehe

[07:03] < Lawouach_> :p

[07:05] < Lawouach_> I had watched that Jamie Oliver program last autumn where he goes to a town up North I think to try to educate folks about cooking well

[07:05] < MS-> Yeah, but they'd all want to smack him

[07:05] < MS-> :)

[07:06] < Lawouach_> yeah :p

[07:06] < Lawouach_> Mind you it was an eye opening to me

[07:06] < Lawouach_> People may be lazy but it's much more profound IMO

[07:07] < Lawouach_> People also lack of time, motivation, money to actually change their habit

[07:07] < Lawouach_> as much as you want to smack him, he shows it like it is

[07:08] < MS-> Maybe - I don't tend to watch things with him in because I find him so annoying :)

[07:09] < MS-> The problems with losing weight is that it does cost more time and more money, and when you're really tired due to stress or overwork

[07:09] < MS-> finding the time & energy is really hard

[07:10] < Lawouach_> Well the problem wetsern countries have reached is that they must put so much time and money into it *because* they've let it slip for decades before

[07:11] < Lawouach_> And Western countries are fantastic machines when it comes down to alienate and pressurise people in a subtle or not so subtle manner

[07:12] < MS-> I'm not so sure about that, actually - about the "letting it slip" thing

[07:12] < Lawouach_> In other words: "you're fat, it's your fault. Now do something about it" is what they say

[07:12] < MS-> The cheapest way to eat, in the west is also the worst for weight & diet.

[07:12] < MS-> Then you're right about the "you're fat, your fault" point

[07:13] < Lawouach_> yes indeed. The fact you have to pay more to eat well isn't new. Our ancestor during middle age had the same trouble

[07:13] < MS-> true

[07:13] < Lawouach_> so nothing our civilised society as actually improved :)

[07:13] < Lawouach_> it's easier to eat everyday, but still we eat poorly

[07:14] < Lawouach_> teh sad thing is costs so much to everyone in the end (healthcare wise :/)

[07:14] < MS-> It's really bizarre though when you start looking at stuff

[07:15] < MS-> For example, a pint of milk or couple of liters of water costs less (by half) than all the "lunch" drinks in the small supermarket near the office.

[07:15] < MS-> And the cheapest sandwiches there cost more than a packet of precooked chicken.

[07:15] < Lawouach_> marketing is the king in our age

[07:16] < MS-> But it's harder to find those things and they're not presented as "lunch foods"

[07:16] < MS-> indeed

[07:16] < Lawouach_> we're conditionned to eat that bag of crisps rather than eat fresh peas

[07:16] < MS-> I think I last had peas from a pod about 30 years ago :)

[07:16] < MS-> So I have to agree

[07:16] < Lawouach_> that being said, I don't want to sound like it's not my fault either. I'm a grown man, I should know better... well know I'm trying to find the energy to fight back

[07:17] < Lawouach_> like you do

[07:17] < Lawouach_> and it ain't easy

[07:17] < MS-> It isn't. I think in all of these things there needs to be a trigger.

[07:17] < MS-> For me it was my foot hurting (ironically).

[07:17] < Lawouach_> heh :)

[07:17] < MS-> Something minor, but hey psychology is wierd

[07:18] < Lawouach_> I can appreciate that

[07:30] < MS-> biab

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[16:03] < vmlemon_> Hi

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[17:50] < MS-> evening

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[20:27] < eikenberry> evening

[20:30] < vmlemon_> Hi eikenberry

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[21:31] < eikenberry> hey vmlemon_1