[06:31] *** vmlemon_ has joined #kamaelia

[06:32] < vmlemon_> Hi

[09:55] *** Uraeus has joined #kamaelia

[10:09] *** MS- has joined #kamaelia

[14:00] *** Davbo has joined #kamaelia

[14:26] *** SamHasler has joined #kamaelia

[15:41] *** eikenberry has joined #kamaelia

[16:14] *** vmlemon_ has joined #kamaelia

[16:15] < vmlemon_> Hi

[16:21] *** vmlemon_ has joined #kamaelia

[16:31] < vmlemon_> kamlogbot: dance

[16:31] Reply: does the macarena

[16:53] *** vmlemon_ has joined #kamaelia

[17:15] *** jae_ has joined #kamaelia

[17:24] *** vmlemon_ has joined #kamaelia

[17:24] < vmlemon_> Hi

[17:26] < vmlemon_> kamlogbot: ecky

[17:26] Reply: Ptang!

[17:49] *** Lawouach has joined #kamaelia

[17:50] < Lawouach> evening boys

[18:22] < Lawouach> http://newteevee.com/2008/12/08/netflix-to-lay-off-50-blames-silverlight/ < - Hah!

[18:22] < vmlemon_> Haha

[18:23] < vmlemon_> Great excuse for when something goes wrong - "Silverlight made me do it!" ;)

[18:35] < vmlemon_> It worked a little *too* well for a Microsoft product ;)

[18:36] < Lawouach> :)

[18:36] < Lawouach> perhaps :)

[18:36] < Lawouach> I'm trying to use FriendFeed but I find it to duplicate the way I'm using Twitter

[18:36] < Lawouach> FF never felt natural to me

[18:37] < vmlemon_> Aah

[18:37] < vmlemon_> I saw that you subscribed to me (or did I subscribe to you?)

[18:38] < Lawouach> you did first a few weeks back

[18:38] < Lawouach> I only ack today

[18:38] < vmlemon_> Aah

[18:39] *** vmlemon_ has a rubbish memory, for what it's worth

[18:40] < vmlemon_> Thanks

[18:40] < vmlemon_> Some say that it takes two attempts to get into FriendFeed ;)

[18:41] < vmlemon_> (It's obligatory that the first experience is a bad one, or so members of the blogger/new member crowd say)

[18:41] < vmlemon_> Although I didn't have any problems diving in

[18:43] < vmlemon_> It seems to get better as you use it, from what I can tell...

[18:43] < vmlemon_> and they added some new features last Friday

[18:44] < vmlemon_> (New language menu with an "Upside Down" option being one of them) ;)

[18:56] < vmlemon_> Heh, http://friendfeed.com/e/6226627a-873f-49e5-8acb-b6eb3ffd5b24/Twitter-users-why-FriendFeed-is-NOT-for-you-http/

[18:58] < Lawouach> indeed

[19:01] < vmlemon_> Simplexity? ;)

[19:09] < vmlemon_> http://friendfeed.com/e/6f2293a3-606c-4b86-bf9b-83a45aa24861/So-I-got-a-whole-bunch-of-followers-today-thanks/ might have some useful comments

[19:14] < vmlemon_> It is a busy place though, and it takes a while to sift through and find the gold

[19:16] < Lawouach> yeah

[19:16] < Lawouach> it's too cluttered for my liking

[19:16] < vmlemon_> Of course, naturally, it's a very different beast to Twitter

[19:17] < vmlemon_> From what I can tell, it seems that the majority of the content is sourced from a small handful of people, with a nucleus of Likes and Comments around each post

[19:18] < vmlemon_> Not to mention that it takes a while until people find your posts and act on them

[19:18] < vmlemon_> Although I'm apparently about 91st on the list of "Most Active Users" last time I checked...

[19:19] < Lawouach> ah :)

[19:19] < Lawouach> but it seems people on FF have become human bots ofr Google-like indexing

[19:20] < Lawouach> I don't think it means much when people have tagged thousands of items

[19:20] < vmlemon_> Heh

[19:20] < vmlemon_> Valid point

[19:20] < Lawouach> what I like about twitter is that it's a bit like chatting in real life, "tell and forget"

[19:20] < vmlemon_> Robert Scoble and Morton Fox are very prolific, from what I've seen

[19:21] < Lawouach> of course tweets aren't deleted but I hardly use them as an index

[19:21] < vmlemon_> (The latter seems to be nicknamed "The Liking Machine" by some) ;)

[19:21] < Lawouach> it's a way to create some buzz around oneself

[19:21] < vmlemon_> I agree with you about Twitter

[19:22] < vmlemon_> (I also use it as a quick braindump/"fire and forget" thing, and occasionally to ask a question or to give my 2p on something)

[19:22] < Lawouach> I'm using Twitter has a way to stay close to some online friends

[19:23] < Lawouach> interestingly many of them are in my GTalk contact list

[19:23] < Lawouach> but we hardly speak over it anymore

[19:23] < Lawouach> I think Twitter is a mix between email and IM

[19:23] < Lawouach> Small, concise and fast like IM

[19:24] < Lawouach> But doesn't have to respond in real time as IM

[19:24] < Lawouach> s/IM/email

[19:24] < vmlemon_> I have a small handful of contacts split between WLM and Google Talk (about 6 or so, excluding 'bots and XMPP Transports), and very few of them are active on either service

[19:24] < vmlemon_> Although I rarely use IM these days

[19:41] *** vmlemon_ is tempted to think of Twitter being like an atom

[19:43] < Lawouach> how so?

[19:43] < vmlemon_> (The user being the "nucleus", and various people of varying levels of "closeness" on different layers of it, similar to protons/neutrons and what have you)

[19:43] < vmlemon_> Probably a bad example though

[19:45] < vmlemon_> You'd have things like spammers and "fly-by-night" users on the outside of the thing, and then work the way in to things like close friends and family members

[19:45] < vmlemon_> Although that does make the assumption that everyone's using it

[19:45] < vmlemon_> (Not always the case)

[19:45] < Lawouach> :)

[19:46] < vmlemon_> Naturally, you'd make "molecules" when you add other Twitter users/atoms and their connected followers

[19:47] *** vmlemon_ thinks a Twitter simulator might be an interesting use for the Kamaelia visualization tools

[19:48] < Lawouach> indeed

[19:48] < Lawouach> could be fun

[19:51] < vmlemon_> Hell, barring the 3000 or so available users limit imposed by Twitter, and the API calling limitations, you could probably feed it real data

[19:51] < vmlemon_> Hmm, Twitter posts, not users

[19:51] < vmlemon_> (Is there a limit on users?)

[19:52] < Lawouach> that's already a good dataset

[20:02] *** vmlemon_ has joined #kamaelia

[20:04] < vmlemon_> Damn, my phone battery conked out

[20:04] < vmlemon_> http://louisgray.com/live/2008/07/twitter-chokes-unauthenticated-api.html has some info on the API rate limiting

[20:04] *** vmlemon_ notes that Pidgin's XMPP console seems interesting

[20:06] < vmlemon_> (I'm just watching it update as new stanzas come in, shame that Google Talk encryption makes it a little trickier to discover their content otherwise)

[20:07] < Patrick`> @pipeline: check this out, 10111101011101010110

[20:07] < vmlemon_> o.O

[20:07] < Lawouach> ?

[20:07] < Patrick`> twitter as a kamaelia visualisation tool

[20:07] < vmlemon_> Hah

[20:08] < vmlemon_> I was thinking of it the other way round, but that might be fun in a twisted way, too ;)

[20:09] < vmlemon_> Not sure why IPv4-over-Twitter comes to mind...

[20:11] *** vmlemon_ wonders how often these http://paster.dazjorz.com/?p=3667 presence messages are sent

[20:13] < vmlemon_> Seems fairly often

[20:14] < vmlemon_> I'd assume that Google's servers would only send out changed data though, and not refresh the old data with the same content

[20:14] *** vmlemon_ looks for the specs

[20:23] < vmlemon_> Haha, "Using FriendFeed is like trying to drink from a firehose."

[20:36] < vmlemon_> Night

[20:37] *** jae_ is now known as jae

[20:38] *** jae is now known as eikenberry

[22:32] *** MS- reads back

[22:37] < MS-> The whole friendfeed vs twitter thing seems bizarre

[22:37] < MS-> And rather irrelevant

[22:37] < MS-> the way someone who has 12,000 followers uses a system is different from someone with 5

[22:40] < MS-> meh

[23:12] *** skylarS has joined #kamaelia