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[06:46] < vmlemon_> Hi

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[07:23] < Lawouach_> morning

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[08:06] < mhrd> greetings

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[09:37] < vmlemon__> kamaeliabot: dance

[09:37] Reply: does the macarena

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[10:02] < Davbo> Morning all

[10:03] < mhrd> hi

[10:50] < Davbo> y'alright mhrd?

[10:51] < mhrd> yeah, ok ta. you?

[10:51] < Davbo> Yeah i'm alright

[10:52] < Davbo> trying to figure out why this wont compile. I thought it was because of different versions of Java at home than uni but both are Java 6 :S

[10:52] < mhrd> what error?

[10:52] < Davbo> Getting errors trying to attach a generic to an ArrayList

[10:53] < Davbo> works fine at home

[10:53] < Davbo> I could just take them off but can't be bothered to edit the code - it's not essential it compiles here just runs here

[10:53] < mhrd> specifically what error ooi?

[10:56] < Davbo> The type ArrayList is not generic; it cannot be parameterized with arguments < Track>

[10:57] < vmlemon> Hi

[10:57] < Davbo> Ah - Syntax error, parameterized types are only available if source level is 5.0

[10:57] < mhrd> you building using netbeans or eclipse or similar?

[10:57] < Davbo> I think i can twist Eclipse's arm to compile for Java 5

[10:57] < Davbo> Yeah

[10:58] < mhrd> yeah, you should be able to fairly easily. the settings are buried somewhere :-)

[10:59] < Davbo> Hmm - need to install Java 5

[10:59] < Davbo> why the hell doesn't that work in Java 6? :/

[10:59] < Davbo> I have the latest version at home and it was fine

[11:00] < Davbo> Argh I hate Java.

[11:01] < Davbo> Hahah fixed it, thanks mhrd

[11:01] < Davbo> it was running in compliance mode for Java 1.4

[11:01] *** mhrd didn't do anything :-)

[11:02] < Davbo> well you reminded me that Eclipse handles all that

[11:02] *** mhrd happy to oblige then

[11:08] < Davbo> Anyone know if ID3v2 is backward compatible with version 1?

[11:08] Reply: Hm?

[11:11] < Davbo> Damn i lost 0.006% by handing my work in late by 1 day :P

[11:11] < mhrd> that all?!

[11:11] < Davbo> Yeah.

[11:11] < Davbo> it's 5% each day

[11:12] < Davbo> but the work doesn't count for much

[11:12] < mhrd> ah, you're looking at how it affects the overall course %age

[11:12] < Davbo> not really, i'm only looking at this module

[11:12] < Davbo> which is 1 of 5 of the course

[11:13] < Davbo> so even less there :)

[11:20] < Davbo> I had a couple of deadlines to juggle so left that one a day late to make sure i did a good job

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[11:26] < vmlemon> Hah, http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=542936&cid=23297352

[11:32] < Davbo> This was inevitable with everyone making "free as in beer" jokes - http://www.opensourcebeerproject.com/

[11:35] *** Davbo wants free as in beer, beer.

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[14:01] < vmlemon_> Hi

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[14:33] < Lawouach_> http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/radiolabs/2008/05/pushing_the_programmes_ontolog.shtml

[15:00] < Lawouach_> hmm me thinks that a proxy component would be handy

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[15:11] < vmlemon_> kamaeliabot: dance

[15:11] Reply: does the macarena

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[16:16] < Lawouach> back

[16:45] *** j_baker is going to try out Fedora 9

[16:46] < Lawouach> http://www.devchix.com/2008/05/10/kamaelia-the-future-of-python-frameworks-looks-promising/

[16:46] < Lawouach> on the main programming page of reddit

[16:48] < mhrd> cool

[16:52] < j_baker> That's pretty awesome

[16:52] *** mhrd breaks his stapler :-(

[16:53] *** mhrd unbreaks it :-)

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[16:58] < Davbo> http://del.icio.us/

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[16:59] < Davbo> Kamaealia on front page

[16:59] < Davbo> pretty cool

[16:59] < Davbo> would like to see stats for today on the site

[16:59] < Lawouach> :)

[17:01] < Davbo> Anyone else a delicious user?

[17:01] < Lawouach> I am although I seldom use it

[17:01] < j_baker> Well, I've never really tasted myself before, but I don't think I taste bad.

[17:02] < Davbo> :P

[17:02] < Davbo> nice one j_baker

[17:02] < j_baker> :P

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[17:03] < Lawouach> lol

[17:03] *** Davbo should have seen that coming

[17:03] < Davbo> :)

[17:04] < vmlemon_> Hi

[17:06] < j_baker> Now we just need to get kamaelia in slashdot and digg.

[17:06] < vmlemon_> It's been featured on Slashdot once

[17:07] < vmlemon_> Or at least in a post about BBC Research in general

[17:07] *** vmlemon_ was playing with Remember The Milk's WAP version, earlier

[17:07] < Davbo> I doubt we'll see it on Digg in the future

[17:07] < Davbo> that website has gone continually down hill

[17:08] < vmlemon_> Someone get the spade for Digg's burial ;)

[17:08] < vmlemon_> (And get Digg-ing ;) )

[17:09] < vmlemon_> Hah, [18:04] [Notice] -irc.helixcommunity.org- Quote: Please refrain from feeding the IRC Operators. Thank you.

[17:09] < j_baker> Indeed Davbo

[17:10] < Davbo> don't get me wrong, i still read it every day :)

[17:11] *** vmlemon_ rarely uses Digg, except to add a point when the Amarok folks have their occasional Digg Blitz

[17:11] < vmlemon_> (Usually after a release)

[17:15] < Davbo> http://del.icio.us/url/c079c50d2078b29f74a1fa89c6272501

[17:15] < Davbo> I'm sure MS would like to see how people sum Kamaelia up

[17:16] < vmlemon_> I wonder if it's in use for any major deployments outside of the BBC

[17:17] < Davbo> Funny thing about open source, how would we know ?

[17:18] < Davbo> SQLite is in *everything* but the guy that made it has no idea

[17:19] < Davbo> (interesting podcast about SQLite at FLOSS weekly - http://www.twit.tv/floss26)

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[17:36] < j_baker> Going to get a haircut. Be back later.

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[18:04] < Chong-> Evening, all.

[18:20] < Davbo> Evenin' Chong-

[18:24] < Chong-> hi Davbo

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[19:14] < vmlemon_> Hi

[19:15] < Davbo> Hey vmlemon_

[19:15] < vmlemon_> o.O "Melts In Your Audioscrobbler, Not In Your Hand."

[19:15] < Davbo> interesting lol

[19:16] < vmlemon_> (From the bottom of a page on last.fm)

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[19:20] < vmlemon_> Looks like they have a rotation of them

[19:28] < vmlemon_> Davbo: Any other weird and wonderful web service suggestions?

[19:29] < vmlemon_> http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=539588&cid=23259400

[19:30] < vmlemon_> http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=539588&cid=23258954

[19:35] < Davbo> delicious is todays pick vmlemon_ :)

[19:36] < vmlemon_> Already have an account...

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[19:40] < Davbo> how about this then vmlemon_ http://www.mailinator.com/

[19:42] < Davbo> another great web service :)

[19:43] *** Davbo wonders how long he can keep this up

[19:43] < vmlemon_> It sounds like some sort of low-budget half-robot, half-space monster movie ;)

[19:44] < Davbo> hah

[19:44] < vmlemon_> Hah, "Let Them Eat Spam"

[19:44] < j_baker> Would the mailinator have Arnold Schwarzenegger in it?

[19:44] < vmlemon_> It's a disposable e-mail account?

[19:44] < vmlemon_> Hah

[19:44] < Davbo> This summer, let them eat spam. THE MAILINATOR! < /move trailer voice over guy>

[19:45] < Davbo> pretty much vmlemon_

[19:45] < j_baker> "Hasta la vista... postage."

[19:45] < j_baker> (best arnold hasta la vista line I could think up)

[19:45] < Davbo> "I need your clothes your boots and your email address"

[19:45] < j_baker> So have you found a good linux distro Davbo?

[19:46] < vmlemon_> Would it be a gigantic, robotic postbox that crushes buildings?

[19:46] < Davbo> Mandriva works a charm j_baker

[19:46] < j_baker> I don't think they have a PPC version though. :(

[19:47] < j_baker> I may end up putting OS X back on my G5. Not because I dislike Linux but because I find it way too difficult to find PPC Linux software.

[19:47] *** vmlemon_ reckons that Don LaFontaine would probably make a suitable voiceover candidate, given that he does pretty much every other movie ad

[19:47] < j_baker> I think I"m gonna have to get an x86 box to screw around with when I get one of my payments. :)

[19:48] < vmlemon_> I was going to say that you can get one for nothing in PC World

[19:48] < Davbo> Fedora 9 was released today

[19:48] < vmlemon_> although they don't have them in the US

[19:48] < Davbo> is there a PPC version of that?

[19:48] < j_baker> Yup. Downloading it right now.

[19:48] < vmlemon_> Didn't they stop making *buntu for PowerPC?

[19:48] < j_baker> No

[19:48] < Davbo> sounds good, although it's too soon to use KDE4 from what i've sen of it

[19:48] < j_baker> But it's unsupported.

[19:49] < j_baker> Fedora 9 uses KDE 4?

[19:49] < Davbo> Yeah

[19:49] < j_baker> vmlemon_ I could get Hardy Heron to work, but I think it involves some yaboot tweaking. And I'm not sure I want to use a distro that won't even boot properly out of the box.

[19:49] < vmlemon_> Aah

[19:49] < Davbo> Well you pick of course, this is Linux after all :)

[19:50] < j_baker> I was going to use gnome anyway. :)

[19:50] < Davbo> but i think it's one of the defaults now

[19:50] < j_baker> I may try out xfce or fluxbox though.

[19:50] *** vmlemon_ has just noticed that he's made the "Top Listeners" section of the Yumi Matsutoya last.fm Artist Page...

[19:50] < Davbo> i'm currently downloading eeeDora for my EEE PC (duh) that runs xfce

[19:51] < j_baker> I'm trying to run eclipse on my G5, but it literally eats up half of my RAM.

[19:51] < vmlemon_> Weeeeeeee!

[19:51] < vmlemon_> ;)

[19:51] < vmlemon_> (I couldn't resist ;) )

[19:51] < Davbo> :)

[19:52] < Davbo> that's Eclipse for you j_baker

[19:52] < j_baker> Yeah. And the PPC version seems to be worse than the x86 version.

[19:52] < j_baker> Even netbeans is more responsive on the PPC.

[19:52] < j_baker> Has anyone tried Wing?

[19:53] < Davbo> Never even heard of it

[19:53] < j_baker> http://www.wingware.com/

[19:54] < j_baker> The trial that I downloaded is pretty awesome.

[19:54] < j_baker> If you're an opensource developer, you can get it for free.

[19:54] < Davbo> Humm

[19:54] < j_baker> Plus it's quasi open source.

[19:55] < j_baker> So I can sign a non-disclosure agreement, download the source and compile it on my G5.

[19:55] < vmlemon_> Sources Available with a huge catch?

[19:55] < j_baker> You have to sign an NDA vmlemon_

[19:55] < vmlemon_> Ouch

[19:55] < vmlemon_> What exactly is Wing?

[19:56] *** vmlemon_ goes to look

[19:56] < j_baker> It's a python IDE.

[19:56] < Davbo> I'm happy with Kate

[19:56] < vmlemon_> Aah

[19:56] < Davbo> this looks a bit extreme for my small Python skills

[19:56] < j_baker> Kate is pretty cool, I want something with a few more features though.

[19:56] < vmlemon_> It's for coding Python? Or it's coded in Python?

[19:56] < j_baker> I've been spoiled by Visual Studio. :)

[19:56] < j_baker> It's for coding python vmlemon_

[19:57] < vmlemon_> OK

[19:57] < j_baker> And I would argue that lack of python skills is more of a reason to get a good IDE than not to get one, Davbo. :)

[19:58] < j_baker> But that's just me.

[19:59] < Davbo> nah, i like working from editing raw code up to whatever catches my fancy after that

[20:00] < j_baker> I can see that. Like I said, I'm spoiled. :)

[20:00] < vmlemon_> Hah, http://www.switched.com/2008/05/12/revolving-license-plate-helps-speeders-evade-cops/

[20:00] < Davbo> hehe

[20:01] < j_baker> For all of microsoft's problems, Visual Studio is probably one of the best IDEs in existance.

[20:02] < j_baker> Heh, they just tried the traffic light idea here in my town vmlemon_

[20:02] < vmlemon_> Anyone tried UndoDB?

[20:02] < j_baker> They discontinued it because they just weren't making enough money from the tickets. :/

[20:02] < vmlemon_> (A reverse-debugger based on a module for GDB)

[20:02] < j_baker> Nope, but it sounds interesting vmlemon_

[20:03] < vmlemon_> It's commercial, but free of cost for open source developers/non-commercial users

[20:03] < j_baker> I can't count the number of times I've been too quick with the step button and wished I could go backwards.

[20:04] < vmlemon_> "Note that there are something like (rough approximate) 830 trillion trillion trillion different Mailinator email addresses. You really do have some latitude to pick a unique one."

[20:04] < j_baker> Wow.

[20:06] < vmlemon_> o.O http://mobile.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/05/01/129230

[20:06] < vmlemon_> Supposedly scented SMS technology from some crazy German folks

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[20:16] < Davb1> Chris Wellwood of Google Inc sent David King 1 FedEx International Economy package(s).

[20:16] < Davb1> :D

[20:16] < vmlemon_> Really?

[20:16] < vmlemon_> What's inside?

[20:16] < vmlemon_> Or isn't it for you?

[20:16] < Davb1> a book.

[20:16] < vmlemon_> Aah

[20:16] < Davb1> no idea what it is

[20:16] < Davb1> but i know there's a book involved

[20:17] < Davb1> ooo yay :D

[20:17] < Davb1> something to sit at the door in anticipation for

[20:17] < j_baker> I wonder when I'm going to get mine?

[20:18] < j_baker> And more importantly, I wonder what book it is.

[20:18] < Davb1> Hmm

[20:18] < vmlemon_> Does everyone involved get something in advance?

[20:19] < vmlemon_> (Prior to the actual prize, if anyone wins it)

[20:21] < j_baker> Yes, everyone gets a book. The t-shirt comes last.

[20:24] < j_baker> I believe you also get various other google merchandise.

[20:28] < j_baker> You know, this deep packet inspection stuff is beginning to scare me.

[20:28] < j_baker> http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080513-charter-enhances-internet-service-with-targeted-ads.html

[20:28] < j_baker> Charter just "enhanced" their service so that now they scan their customers' packets for ad targetting.

[20:28] < vmlemon_> Ugh

[20:29] < vmlemon_> And we'll soon be enjoying that wonderful "feature" soon, too

[20:29] < vmlemon_> at least on the ISP triopoly

[20:29] < vmlemon_> Well, a duopoly, plus some mobile phone dealer that also happens to resell Internet access services

[20:30] < j_baker> Really? I think we're headed the same way.

[20:30] < j_baker> Before too much longer, it's just going to be Comcast and AT&T

[20:31] < vmlemon_> (BT, Virgin Media and TalkTalk)

[20:32] < vmlemon_> The former is/was (semi-)government owned for years, the 2nd is the rather mangled result of merging NTL and Telewest, and then buying out the majority shareholder's stake of Virgin Mobile, the latter is an arm of a rather large mobile phone dealer that also happens to own AOL's UK broadband division

[20:33] < vmlemon_> (Carphone Warehous)

[20:33] < vmlemon_> *Warehouse

[20:33] < vmlemon_> even

[20:34] < vmlemon_> Of course, at least here, almost every ISP resells services from BT (IPStream, I think)

[20:34] < vmlemon_> Which perpetuates the duopoly thing somewhat

[20:34] < vmlemon_> and is probably the reason why most ISPs offer crappy services

[20:37] < vmlemon_> Let me guess, it's a result of an under-the-coffee table transaction with some shady company like Phorm (although there are others offering the same "service" in the US)?

[20:39] < j_baker> Nah, it's just a result of the FCC looking the other way when gigantic companies want to merge.

[20:40] < j_baker> A somewhat comical example is that the FCC didn't care when SBC, AT&T, and Bell South merged.

[20:40] < j_baker> But then Whole Foods and Wild Oats (two organic food stores wanted to merge)

[20:40] < j_baker> And the FCC blocked it saying it would kill competition

[20:40] < j_baker> ...

[20:40] < vmlemon_> Aren't they trying to make a Frankenstein's Monster Bell 2.0?

[20:41] < j_baker> Anyway, I'm going to run to the grocery store.

[20:41] < j_baker> biab

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[20:48] < vmlemon_> Ouch "**** Your system is too SLOW to play this! ****"

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[22:26] < vmlemon__> Ugh, I'm having to resort to uploading a 8MB+ file in 100KB chunks, and then reassembling it with cat on the other side

[22:27] *** vmlemon__ hopes that he can manage to reassemble it so that the MD5 checksum matches the original file :|

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[22:32] < vmlemon__> I suppose that I could just take the whole file and upload it at college tomorrow, seeing as the connection is infinitely more reliable, and much, much faster

[22:34] *** vmlemon__ wants a "Reverse-BitTorrent" protocol of some kind

[22:58] < vmlemon__> Yay, and the MD5 checksum matches

[22:58] < vmlemon__> What fun that was :(

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