[12:51] *** kamaeliabot has joined #kamaelia

[12:55] *** MS- has joined #kamaelia

[12:55] < MS-> afternoon

[12:55] *** MS- back

[12:55] < vmlemon_> Hi

[12:55] < orphans> hey MS-

[12:56] < orphans> good holiday?

[12:56] < MS-> looks like the logger (well, the machine running the logger) crashed on April 1st

[12:56] < MS-> orphans: yes thanks :)

[12:56] < MS-> much needed - first proper holiday in a very long while

[12:56] < orphans> kamaeliabot: dance

[12:56] Reply: does the macarena

[12:56] < orphans> :)

[12:57] < orphans> MS-: cool

[12:57] *** MS- notes the application deadline was extended

[13:01] *** MS- notes an application proposes as a 3 months project an idea that I implemented in an evening a week before LUG Radio last year which is described (in detail) in one of the kamaelia presentations on slideshare

[13:01] < MS-> (tree based P2P restreaming of live video)

[13:01] < MS-> Only difference is it uses vlc rather than mplayer

[13:01] < MS-> (as the playback client)

[13:04] < MS-> described here for those curious http://www.slideshare.net/kamaelian/building-systems-with-kamaelia

[13:09] < MS-> Builds up to it, and starts with the P2P core on around slide 40

[13:09] < MS-> (A P2P core is pretty trivial with kamaelia since you just publish data you recieve to a backplane

[13:09] < MS-> and then pick up the data from the backplane for playback and for any new clients

[13:10] < MS-> OOh, simon89 - I don't suppose you have a further iteration do you?

[13:10] < MS-> :)

[13:13] *** MS- guess simon89's not around

[13:13] *** MS- checks mail

[13:13] < MS-> (though that'll've been dead for 4 days too)

[13:27] < MS-> ~700 emails at home...

[13:27] *** simon89 is back

[13:28] < MS-> ~4000 emails at work

[13:28] < MS-> only nearly 5000 mails from a week away, not too shabby

[13:29] *** MS- might declare email bankruptcy

[13:29] < orphans> :-o

[13:30] < orphans> 5000?!?

[13:30] < orphans> how much of that is spam?

[13:30] < vmlemon_> Ouch

[13:30] < vmlemon_> o.O http://port25.technet.com/archive/2008/04/01/microsoft-open-source-initiative.aspx

[13:32] *** orphans coffees

[13:33] *** simon89 hates april first, you newer know wats true and not :(

[13:35] *** vmlemon_ has joined #kamaelia

[13:37] < MS-> orphans: My work email spam fillter is pretty awful

[13:38] < orphans> sounds it

[13:38] < MS-> It does catch significant amounts, but about 80-90% of email at work is spam

[13:38] < MS-> what's worse is that I really need to switch on an autoresponder if I'm not there

[13:39] < MS-> so around 30-50% of those emails are bounces from non-existant addresses

[13:39] < MS-> repeating the spams

[13:39] < MS-> My home email is virtually spam free by comparison, due to the spam killer I created last october :-D

[13:40] < MS-> So those 700 emails are likely 95-99% non-spam

[13:40] < MS-> Though I suspect most are mainly gsoc related and largely noise from -discuss

[13:40] < orphans> heh, you're awful popular/subscribe to too many mailing lists

[13:40] < orphans> yeah

[13:41] < MS-> too many mailing lists :)

[13:41] *** vmlemon_ has about 200 e-mails, mostly from mailing lists, and promotional stuff from organizations after only using their site once to download software/specification documents

[13:41] < MS-> Or rather too many high traffic lists

[13:41] < vmlemon_> *new e-mails

[13:57] *** vmlemon__ has joined #kamaelia

[13:58] *** MS- will start reading the logs from when he was away shortly

[13:58] < MS-> Though those are missing huge chunks naturally

[13:58] < MS-> I wonder if anyone else has any logs they're willing to share? (Say from their chat client?)

[13:59] < vmlemon__> I have a few on my box that I connect to with SSH

[13:59] < vmlemon__> if they're any use

[13:59] < MS-> It'd be of interest

[13:59] < vmlemon__> Just a second#

[13:59] < MS-> No rush though :)

[14:00] < vmlemon__> Just need to log in and make a symlink to them

[14:00] < MS-> np

[14:03] *** Davbo has joined #kamaelia

[14:03] < Davbo> Good Afternoon all

[14:04] < vmlemon__> Hi Davbo

[14:04] < orphans> afternoon

[14:06] < vmlemon__> MS-: They should be available at http://house404.co.uk/irclogs/ now

[14:06] < vmlemon__> Not sure why, but my client ended up splitting it into two by Freenode server

[14:12] < MS-> vmlemon_: That's great - thanks :)

[14:12] < Davbo> oh MS- returns, how was the holiday?

[14:13] < MS-> good thanks

[14:13] < vmlemon__> No problem

[14:25] *** vmlemon__ is now known as vmlemon_

[14:28] < Davbo> they pushed the delivery of my eeepc back to 11th :(

[14:30] < vmlemon_> Just hope that DHL isn't delivering it... ;)

[14:30] *** Lawouach has joined #kamaelia

[14:31] < Davbo> Heh, bad experience vmlemon_ ?

[14:31] < Davbo> Hi Lawouach

[14:31] < vmlemon_> Yeah

[14:31] < Lawouach> hello

[14:31] < vmlemon_> They managed to lose a HDD that I ordered ages ago, and it took about 3 days for them to finally admit that their driver signed for it and sent it elsewhere

[14:32] < vmlemon_> I did get it off them in the end, though

[14:34] < Davbo> Yeah this has to be signed for so hopefully it will be okay :)

[14:36] < vmlemon_> Hah, "Think of Microsoft Windows like the Flu. If you're very careful, you might be able to avoid it -- at least for a while. However sooner or later, you'll get caught. And when you do, you'll fell miserable."

[14:38] < Davbo> lol :P snowing where you are vmlemon_ ?

[14:38] < vmlemon_> No Sno'

[14:39] < Davbo> Just started again quite heavy in Sheffield

[14:39] < orphans> snow? it's well sunny here!

[14:40] < vmlemon_> Grey sky with clouds, and a strong breeze here

[14:45] *** Davbo forgot we shouldn't talk about the bad weather in the UK while Lawouach, make him feel smug ;)

[14:46] < Lawouach> :)

[14:47] < Davbo> "while Lawouach is here" I meant - I've only been awake an hour, can't type :(

[14:48] < MS-> Davbo: I note that you didn't update your application with regard to the problems I noted about multicore aspects. (ie the fact that multicore comes for free when using multiwindow pygame)

[14:48] < Davbo> Hmm? sec.

[14:49] < Lawouach> Hi MS-, hope you enjoyed your break.

[14:50] < Davbo> MS-, okay if I talk to you off-channel?

[14:50] < vmlemon_> o.O "Port 25 is home to the open source community at Microsoft"...

[14:51] < vmlemon_> Hmm, Microsoft has an open source community?

[15:04] < MS-> vmlemon_: Yes, they do.

[15:04] < MS-> which IMO they need to foster for their long term benefit

[15:05] *** MS- makes an on-channel comment regarding the fact that edits that should've happened haven't made it through for some reason. (maybe a bug in the gsoc webapp)

[15:07] < MS-> SNOW!

[15:07] *** MS- sits here with peeling sunburn, and watches the snow :)

[15:07] < Davbo> haha just stopped in Sheffield :(

[15:07] < vmlemon_> Just started up here, now you say that

[15:07] < Davbo> its moved to vmlemon_ lol

[15:08] < orphans> hopefully got a couple of hours before it reaches this far south...

[15:08] < orphans> im sposed to be going to play frisbee at 6 :)

[15:08] < vmlemon_> I wonder if the neighbours will get their washing in before it goes damp...

[15:30] < Davbo> honestly vmlemon_ you can't leave us all in suspense like this

[15:30] < Davbo> :P

[15:31] *** Davbo is dying to know the status of vmlemon_'s neighbours washing

[15:31] < vmlemon_> Hah, the snow has slowed down, and the washing is still out

[15:31] < vmlemon_> And it's still cold...

[15:32] < MS-> Davbo: You missed the obvious pun.

[15:32] *** vmlemon_ is downloading the AIR for Linux Alpha

[15:33] < Davbo> I missed a pun??

[15:33] < MS-> yep

[15:33] < MS-> vmlemon_: left us hanging

[15:33] < vmlemon_> Hah

[15:33] < MS-> seems pretty cut and dried to me

[15:35] *** Davbo cringes

[16:01] *** robertofaga has joined #kamaelia

[16:11] < MS-> robertofaga: were you thinking of putting an application in for kamaelia?

[16:11] < vmlemon_> Hmm, does IronPython work on Mono?

[16:11] < MS-> yes

[16:12] < Lawouach> vmlemon, yes definitely

[16:12] < MS-> jle: Same question goes to you as well :-)

[16:13] < MS-> barrycarlyon: same q to you too :-D

[16:13] < Davbo> This is probably a bad thing to admit to but all my knowledge of Mono is from LugRadio, is it like a .net thing ?

[16:13] < Davbo> lol I'll go look it up

[16:13] < Lawouach> Davbo, it is a free implementation of .NET yes

[16:13] < vmlemon_> Yup, it's a clone/unofficial "port"

[16:14] < MS-> vmlemon_: Microsoft apparently support it

[16:14] < Lawouach> vmlemon, this isn't really true considering .NET is an official standard

[16:14] < Lawouach> there is no clone.

[16:14] < Lawouach> Just implementations

[16:14] < vmlemon_> I was just thinking of downloading a copy of IP to try

[16:14] < vmlemon_> out of curiosity

[16:14] < MS-> To the extent that they've apparently blessed (whatever that means) the moonlight implementation of silverlight on mono

[16:14] < Lawouach> The only bend mono does is that they enforce a closer match of the .NET implementation from Microsoft rather than the specifications

[16:14] < jle> MS-: *cough* With half a day left to go, I doubt I can make an impressive enough application. I'll be at SoC next year though, when I'm hit less by other things during the application time.

[16:14] < Davbo> Oh very clever! what with there being a high demand for .NET developers I could work with it and not feel dirty

[16:15] < vmlemon_> I heard about that...

[16:15] < Lawouach> uh!

[16:15] < vmlemon_> It integrates with your UNIX/GNOME apps too

[16:15] < Lawouach> it snows down here too

[16:15] < MS-> jle: Things that are impressive are ideas and a roughly thought out disucssion of them. Our template is designed to try and help you fwiw

[16:15] < MS-> You can find the template app here: http://kamaelia.sourceforge.net/SummerOfCode2006Template

[16:16] < MS-> Mind you you're more than welcome to hang around :)

[16:16] < vmlemon_> and somewhat ironically, there happens to be extensions to integrate with Cocoa on Mac OS X

[16:16] < jle> MS-: Hm. Cheers, I'll take a look. Anyway, I think I'll hang around a while since there's some nice people here.

[16:16] < MS-> :)

[16:17] < vmlemon_> (although I happen to be more of a KDE person, not to start a flamewar ;) )

[16:18] < vmlemon_> Didn't they get ECMA to file it as a standard, eons ago?

[16:18] < Lawouach> They did

[16:19] < Lawouach> .NET and C# are actually great platforms

[16:19] < Lawouach> One downside of IP is that the .NET framework is not really pythonic :)

[16:19] < Davbo> hmm I really don't know much about Mono / .Net but is it a lot like java and the JVM ?

[16:19] < Lawouach> yes

[16:20] < vmlemon_> They adopted quite a lot of concepts from Java, and some would say that they've improved on them

[16:21] < Davbo> Interesting, we program in Java byte-code at Uni (don't laugh :P) is that like programming in this CIL thing

[16:23] *** vmlemon__ has joined #kamaelia

[16:23] < Davbo> although If the alternative to programming in Java byte-code was ASM i'm perfectly happy with the byte-code t

[16:24] < vmlemon__> Ugh, damn connection

[16:24] < vmlemon__> I did try the "Hello World!" C# sample, and found it somewhat novel that I could reuse the same compiled binary on Linux and Windows

[16:25] < vmlemon__> How fun, Firefox's Download Pause/Resume function seems broken

[16:26] *** Davbo just discovered J# and now has a headache

[16:26] < Davbo> so it's Java but for .NET?

[16:27] *** vmlemon__ is now known as vmlemon_

[16:27] < vmlemon_> And source compatibility is one-way only, if you decide to use the many .NET-specific features :|

[16:28] < vmlemon_> Although that's pretty much the idea

[16:29] < Davbo> interesting

[16:31] < vmlemon_> I'd assume that they call it J#, since Sun won't let them call it Java without meeting certain stringant requirements

[16:33] < Davbo> Yeah

[16:33] < Davbo> Did everyone see the Vista source code that got leaked? http://i29.tinypic.com/10gidzr.jpg

[16:35] < barrycarlyon> Funny :-)

[16:35] *** vmlemon__ has joined #kamaelia

[16:36] *** Davbo thinks it gives MS too much credit, I doubt they keep to naming conventions :P

[16:37] < vmlemon__> Argh, stupid connection keeps flaking out :(

[16:37] < vmlemon__> Not forgetting the tussle ages ago with them being prevented from shipping their version of the JRE

[16:37] *** vmlemon__ is now known as vmlemon_

[16:37] < MS-> Davbo: It's an update of a very very very old joke

[16:39] < MS-> (a not particularly entertaining one at that really)

[16:42] < Davbo> hmm, well it made me chuckle at least

[16:42] < Davbo> I've never seen it before though

[16:49] < Davbo> obviously not on the bleeding edge of internet culture like you are ;)

[16:52] < vmlemon_> What is it?

[16:52] < Davbo> Silly joke about Vista http://i29.tinypic.com/10gidzr.jpg :P

[16:53] < vmlemon_> Hah

[16:58] < vmlemon_> Don't they lace the code with a load of sleep() calls for extended periods of time to slow it down?

[17:01] < Davbo> Made me laugh because I had an error when i first installed Vista that pretty much said "Driver incompatibility error" and had to get a new network adapter

[17:02] < Davbo> despite generic oss drivers working on linux

[17:07] < vmlemon_> Someone should start an effort to port Linux drivers to Vista ;)

[17:08] < barrycarlyon> Just downloaded the mega pack, and running throught the install, installed axon and kamaelia ok but got a "checking for C++ compiler default output file name... configure: error: C++ compiler cannot create executables

[17:08] < barrycarlyon> " when i tried to configure dirac...

[17:09] < barrycarlyon> any ideas?

[17:10] < vmlemon_> Installed g++?

[17:10] < barrycarlyon> nope....

[17:11] < vmlemon_> Might explain why...

[17:11] < vmlemon_> (Just a guess)

[17:11] < barrycarlyon> which version of g++ should i get, im on ubuntu, and synaptic package is giving a few options....

[17:11] < barrycarlyon> never mind g++ with no numbers is latest...

[17:11] < vmlemon_> Try the latest version available from the list

[17:12] < vmlemon_> OK

[17:12] < barrycarlyon> oooooh it asked for the cd....

[17:13] < vmlemon_> Try enabling the rest of the repositories, and disabling the CD ones

[17:13] < barrycarlyon> i already put the cd in, im still relatively new to ubuntu :-)

[17:13] < barrycarlyon> (i have the CD)

[17:14] < vmlemon_> Aah

[17:14] < barrycarlyon> should i disable the cd anyway or leave it selected?

[17:15] < vmlemon_> Probably best to disable the CD for now, and let updates come from the repositories

[17:15] < barrycarlyon> thanks :-)

[17:16] < vmlemon_> Might be a good idea to install build-essential (I think, although I haven't used *buntu for a while)

[17:16] < vmlemon_> since it includes most of the other components you'll need for compiling stuff

[17:17] < barrycarlyon> how does one install build-essential?

[17:17] < vmlemon_> Should be listed in Synaptic

[17:17] < vmlemon_> if you do a quick search

[17:17] < barrycarlyon> makes sense :-)

[17:18] < vmlemon_> Might be plural, or it might be called something else, that said

[17:18] < barrycarlyon> didnt take long to download it...that was surprising...

[17:18] < vmlemon_> They're usually fairly compact

[17:19] < vmlemon_> You might need -dev/-devel packages for certain things later

[17:19] < vmlemon_> Shame that the toolchain/compilers don't come on the CD with the rest of *buntu

[17:19] < barrycarlyon> lol

[17:20] < vmlemon_> Although Fedora don't ship them on the CD either, that said

[17:20] < MS-> Kamaelia doesn't require Dirac to run. Only the dirac components/examples require dirac & dirac bindings to be installed

[17:20] < barrycarlyon> -dev/-devel packages?

[17:20] < MS-> fwiw

[17:21] *** barrycarlyon knows i dont need Dirac but is doing the recommended install :-)

[17:21] < MS-> :)

[17:21] < vmlemon_> They're additional files like headers and utilities needed for compiling certain things

[17:21] *** MS- makes note to self that the recommended install needs updating :)

[17:21] < barrycarlyon> it does say optional c libs....

[17:22] < MS-> indeed :)

[17:22] < vmlemon_> They ought to include them in the packages to save people from trying to find them, although they'll make the packages bulkier (so some reckon)

[17:23] < MS-> vmlemon_: And people wonder why I use suse...

[17:23] < vmlemon_> Kitchen Sink CD, anyone?

[17:23] < barrycarlyon> Yes please ;-)

[17:24] < vmlemon_> It's probably the justification for the gigantic Install DVDs that some distributions offer

[17:24] < vmlemon_> (although they're usually lacking)

[17:24] < barrycarlyon> lol

[17:25] < MS-> vmlemon_: I normally just install everything off a SuSE DVD and be done with it

[17:25] < vmlemon_> Good idea...

[17:25] < MS-> It's only few gig after install after all

[17:25] < vmlemon_> HDDs are large enough these days, and you'll never know when you'll need the extra trinkets

[17:25] *** barrycarlyon might assemble his spare computer and put SuSE on it....

[17:26] *** vmlemon_ is probably one of the few people who haven't tried SuSE yet

[17:27] < MS-> vmlemon_: I started off with a 4 floppy distro many years back, moved to slackware, then redhat, then suse, back to redhat, back to suse, and kinda stuck with it, trying debian & ubuntu periodically to see if it was worth the hassle

[17:28] < MS-> Slowly ubuntu has been getting there IMO

[17:28] < barrycarlyon> new ubuntu in 20 days or so

[17:28] < vmlemon_> Shame that most Linux distributions assume that everyone and their cat/dog have broadband these days...

[17:29] < vmlemon_> (it makes it a real pain to have to download gigantic update packages, if you only have a slow connection)

[17:31] < vmlemon_> Although that's the way of the world

[17:31] < MS-> vmlemon_: Suse tends to use binary deltas

[17:32] < MS-> also the install doesn't require updates to be installed at install time, but does encourage/enable this

[17:32] < vmlemon_> I still need to install about 500+ updates, since I haven't been online for over a year now

[17:32] < barrycarlyon> crikey...

[17:32] < vmlemon_> Which is going to be fun

[17:33] < MS-> cf: patch updates: http://download.opensuse.org/update/10.3/rpm/i586/

[17:33] < MS-> 21K update verse 1.0 MB for example

[17:33] < vmlemon_> Interesting

[17:33] < Davbo> when did openSuse start now?

[17:33] < MS-> ?

[17:33] < MS-> SuSE has been around for yonks

[17:34] < MS-> been open suse for a few years

[17:34] < vmlemon_> Wasn't it back in 2000/2001 for OpenSuSE?

[17:34] < Davbo> I used it as SuSE but never openSuSE

[17:34] < vmlemon_> 4.4 kb/sec according to KPPP :|

[17:34] < MS-> bit later I think. Not much later

[17:34] < Davbo> Must be later i doubt i tinkered with it when i was 11

[17:34] < vmlemon_> Hah, maximum peak speed was 8 kb/sec

[17:35] < MS-> whois on opensuse.org says:

[17:35] < MS-> Created On:05-Jul-2005 18:49:38 UTC

[17:36] *** vmlemon_ checks the Ubuntu website

[17:37] < Davbo> Yeah that sounds more realistic, I remember installing SuSe when I was like 13

[17:38] *** maveriick has joined #kamaelia

[17:39] < maveriick> hi erveybody

[17:39] < Davbo> Hi

[17:39] < vmlemon_> Hi

[17:39] < vmlemon_> If I remember correctly, 130+ of the updates were security related

[17:40] < vmlemon_> (131)

[17:41] < vmlemon_> Yay, a new version of 'eject', just what I always wanted ;)

[17:41] < Davbo> lol

[17:42] < vmlemon_> Ooh, from 2.1.5-5.i386 to 0:2.1.5-7.fc8

[17:47] < Davbo> Hah. Looking at the SuSE website reminded me why I chose to install it over any alternative. It has the best logo

[17:48] < vmlemon_> Innovative way to choose a new OS/Linux distribution ;)

[17:48] < maveriick> Debian logo - isn't it way too cool than Suse?

[17:49] < vmlemon_> [18:47] < TomJ> It's nice that the SXCE install provides a desktop switcher with 4 options. I've often wanted to look at a blank desktop while installing Solaris

[17:49] < Davbo> Nah I still don't like the Debian logo

[17:50] < Davbo> Poor Solaris, some guys from Sun came to Uni to do a talk on Solaris and ZFS

[17:50] < Davbo> interesting stuff from what i heard, i had a lecture at the time though

[17:51] < Davbo> got a bag of swag with a live CD though

[17:51] *** vmlemon_ wants DTrace and ZFS for Linux

[17:51] < Davbo> Shame Solaris has a terrible logo really.

[17:51] < Davbo> :P

[17:52] < vmlemon_> I have some Solaris install CDs lying around...

[17:55] *** dave__ has joined #kamaelia

[17:55] < vmlemon_> Anyone tried SCO OpenServer?

[17:56] *** dave__ is now known as Davbo_

[17:57] < vmlemon_> Be Where? ;)

[17:58] < Davbo_> hehe :)

[17:59] < vmlemon_> Or is that even Bet Here? ;)

[18:00] < Davbo_> lol

[18:00] < MS-> vmlemon_: "Anyone tried SCO OpenServer?" - is that a joke? :-)

[18:00] < Davbo_> My ISP is also a bookies ;)

[18:00] < vmlemon_> You can get a free trial copy from their FTP site...

[18:01] < MS-> but why would I want to?

[18:01] < MS-> :)

[18:01] < vmlemon_> No idea

[18:01] < vmlemon_> I'm sure someone in the world would want that toxic waste

[18:02] < Davbo_> isn't there a lawsuit between SCO and Novell?

[18:02] < vmlemon_> It was pretty useless when I tried it

[18:03] < vmlemon_> Yeah, it involved Red Hat, Novell, and some car companies for some reason

[18:03] < Davbo_> Yeah, all i know of SCO is based off that story i read on /. a while ago now

[18:04] < vmlemon_> Sue Crazy Operation I call them...

[18:06] < vmlemon_> o.O "The photo above is a closeup I took of the tux penguins seen with the human lab inhabitants in the final photo of Steve’s photo tour. You’ll note that the tux-es look healthy and happy. No daggers or other sharp objects have been hurled at them :-)"

[18:12] *** Davbo_ is now known as Davbo

[18:28] < barrycarlyon> Onto installing pygame now, and I get this: nothing in synaptic matches SDL either:

[18:28] < barrycarlyon> Hunting dependencies...

[18:28] < barrycarlyon> sh: sdl-config: not found

[18:28] < barrycarlyon> WARNING: "sdl-config" failed!

[18:28] < barrycarlyon> sh: smpeg-config: not found

[18:28] < barrycarlyon> WARNING: "smpeg-config" failed!

[18:28] < barrycarlyon> Unable to run "sdl-config". Please make sure a development version of SDL is installed.

[18:29] < barrycarlyon> What is SDL?

[18:29] < vmlemon_> libSDL?

[18:30] < barrycarlyon> found it :-)

[18:30] < barrycarlyon> Thanks :-)

[18:31] < vmlemon_> Might need the libSDL-dev or libSDL-devel packages, too

[18:31] < barrycarlyon> installing libSDL-dev

[18:32] < barrycarlyon> the normal was allready installed...

[18:33] < MS-> doesn't ubuntu have a pygame package?

[18:34] < barrycarlyon> ill look

[18:34] < barrycarlyon> nope

[18:34] < MS-> (which is a better option really IMO)

[18:34] < MS-> really?

[18:34] < MS-> how freaky

[18:34] < simon89> in debian its named python-pygame, should be same in ubuntu

[18:34] < barrycarlyon> indeed no it doesnt ....

[18:34] < barrycarlyon> ah yes

[18:34] < barrycarlyon> found it :-)

[18:35] < vmlemon_> Doesn't the Megabundle ship pygame?

[18:35] < barrycarlyon> yi[

[18:35] < barrycarlyon> yip

[18:35] < barrycarlyon> thats where my SDL error came from

[18:35] < vmlemon_> Aah

[18:36] < MS-> vmlemon_: yes, it does, but the intent is "use these if your distro doesn't supply them"

[18:36] < MS-> or "if you experience problems with the version with your distro, try this"

[18:37] < vmlemon_> OK

[18:37] < barrycarlyon> found python ao and python pyrex from distro :-)

[18:41] < MS-> Pyrex is a possible issue BTW

[18:41] < MS-> since it has changed at different points in time

[18:42] < MS-> So you may find you need the version we ship.

[18:42] < barrycarlyon> ah

[18:42] < MS-> But you may not

[18:42] < Davbo> I had to use the one from the megabundle

[18:42] < barrycarlyon> thanks for the heads up :-)

[18:42] *** Davbo is on Xubuntu

[18:43] < Davbo> might work for you though barrycarlyon

[18:43] < barrycarlyon> lol

[18:44] < Davbo> it's hocus pocus ;)

[18:50] < barrycarlyon> im on to "Installing Python support for VorbisSimple" the python binding install its thrown what looks like syntax errors....

[18:51] < barrycarlyon> anywho i have to dissappear for a couple of hours ill be back later if not tomorrow

[18:51] *** barrycarlyon is now known as bcarlyon|away

[18:55] < orphans> pygame is under python-pygame in ubuntu

[18:56] < orphans> might be universe though?

[19:04] < Davbo> He got pygame installed I believe simon89 helped him out :)

[19:04] < orphans> oh crap, sorry. Wasn't scrolled to the bottom :D

[19:05] *** orphans forgets the basics of working modern UIs *sigh*

[19:07] < vmlemon_> Back in a moment

[19:11] *** vmlemon___ has joined #kamaelia

[19:11] < vmlemon___> Hi again

[19:22] *** MS- wanders off for a while

[19:22] *** MS- has parted #kamaelia

[19:28] *** vmlemon_ has joined #kamaelia

[19:35] *** MS- has joined #kamaelia

[19:40] *** MS- has parted #kamaelia

[22:08] < Davbo> night all

[23:57] *** rave has joined #kamaelia

[23:57] < rave> i m here regardin my app

[23:57] < rave> nebdy?

[23:59] < rave> everybdy sleepin

[23:59] < rave> :(